[quote]- speed - system works very, very slow while updating and creating specially with medium and larger websites
lot's of bugs (problems with deleting assets from trash)
no databases for each website
runs on java
complicated things are not possible
not much control from front end for not experienced users
good for small websites
not possible to use any other language apart from java
problems with importing
can't work without problems on larger websites (updating, crashing…)
listings are working slower and slower with increasing amount of documents
not a online community system
simple editor have own mind
to much hassle when doing little things ( locks - change - submit - edit - save )[/quote]
We have several very large systems that run Matrix without performance issues – you need to ensure that your resources are adequate to meet your performance requirements. You also need to ensure that you have enabled the Cache Manager for at least Public level caching and enabled the Send Cacheable Headers option in the System Configuration.
We have no reported bugs about purging the trash. If you are experiencing problems with this, please report your issues so that we can work to resolve them.
You can install individual installations of Matrix for each website on the same hardware if you want separate databases for each site.
Matrix does not run on Java – it is a pure PHP application. The only piece of Java is the asset map (which runs on the client, not the server)
We run very, very complex websites in Matrix. Matrix provides endless configuration capabilities.
As I said, we have several very large websites (500,000+ items) running Matrix.
Matrix is written in PHP, so all server-side development would be in PHP, not Java.
Matrix supports structured importing from several sources: XML, CSV, HTML and Word, as well as bulk binary file importing.
Again, we run very large sites with lots of authors (100+) without any issues.
Listings need to be configured appropriately with the size of the document store in mind.
True, but it is pretty simple to integrate the SSV version of Matrix to other applications like IP.Board and other PostgreSQL/MySQL based applications through the DB Data Source
I'd need more information to comment on this!
True, there is a process to make small changes, including locking. This is to ensure data integrity though and is usually pretty quick, especially when you use the keyboard shortcuts (Alt-A to lock, Alt-R to release, Alt-S to save in IE, Alt-Shift-A, Alt-Shift-R and Alt-Shift-S in Firefox).
Obviously this forum is provided to assist MySource Matrix users with implementation and support, but please ensure that this doesn't turn into a Matix-bashing thread.
Hmm…I can honestly say that I have never had problems like this with Matrix. AND, I could write a list of my Pros that would be about 1000 items long, but I don't really want to take the time right now!
But really, MySource Matrix is the most amazing CMS in the world. For real. I never want to use anything else. It is like using a Mac, once you use one, you get hooked, and you realize how rediculous and aweful the rest of the computing world is. And you never want to use anything else, that is how I feel at least.
I have been happy about every aspect of Matrix. It provides such amazing flexability allowing us to be extremely creative, while knowing that Matrix will be able to support the ideas that we come up with. If there is one thing that I am in love with more than anything, it is triggers. What wonderful things!
Honestly, I am in love with it.
Just my take on it.
I say we keep this discussion open, I would be happy to continually tell anyone how great Matrix is.
Ha ha are you guys smoking something! I'm sorry Matrix is good for some things but I wouldn't say it's the best thing in the world! I would agree it is not good for large community based websites for example!
Anyway not going to start Matrix bashing but can I just point out one thing regarding this:
"it is a pure PHP application." - If this is the case why do i need to install certain versions of Java (3.10 has problems with latest Java) every time i need to train a client on how to edit their sites?!
…and just one question:
"it is pretty simple to integrate the SSV version of Matrix to other applications like IP.Board and other PostgreSQL/MySQL based applications through the DB Data Source" - out of interest how would I do this exactly?
Matrix itself is PHP and all extensions for it are PHP/JS/HTML/CSS only. The editing interfaces use a Java applet to represent and work with the asset tree. The question Avi was responding to was that modifications to Matrix must be done using Java, which is incorrect as modifications to the core product and extensions are never done using Java.
[quote]"it is pretty simple to integrate the SSV version of Matrix to other applications like IP.Board and other PostgreSQL/MySQL based applications through the DB Data Source" - out of interest how would I do this exactly?[/quote]
The SSV version contains, among other things, the IPB and Data packages. The IPB package allows IP.Board users to log into Matrix and author content. We use this module to allow our clients to use their forum accounts to access the SSV documentation on the Matrix site. The Data package allows you to grab data from external databases (and other sources) and then redisplay it. We use the Data package (and the graphing tools it contains) to present information about our forums and bug tracker from within the Matrix web site:
Matrix certainly has areas where is shines and areas where other products can get the job done better. If there was one "best" CMS product there wouldn't be so many of them around. Each has its place and some have more functionality than others.
One of the great strengths of Matrix is its flexibility. It is not designed to be any specific products, but rather more like a content management framework. This actually makes implementing some features harder because they don't come out of the box (like an image library) but once you know how to use the tools, you will find that it allows for almost all aspects of the site to be customised, including the editing interfaces. I love seeing Matrix installs that use the tools we built in ways we didn't imagine, and Nic's site and editing interface is a great example of that. I guess Nic really loves the product because it lets him show his natural talents.
Every product has it's evangelists (although most don't incorporate that into their official title; I'm looking at you Avi) and I'm happy to have you as a supporter Nic. Thanks for your kind words.
Also, v3.10 is very, very old. You should upgrade to the latest version of MySource Matrix (v3.16.7 or v3.18.0 if you want PHP5) instead of trying to support such an old version.
If you are basing your stability and performance observations on v3.10, then you are significantly out of date. The product is much more stable, feature-rich and faster, particularly the new PHP5 version. I urge you to consider upgrading to or at least installing and trying the latest version.
I love seeing Matrix installs that use the tools we built in ways we didn't imagine, and Nic's site and editing interface is a great example of that. I guess Nic really loves the product because it lets him show his natural talents.
Every product has it's evangelists (although most don't incorporate that into their official title; I'm looking at you Avi) and I'm happy to have you as a supporter Nic. Thanks for your kind words.[/quote]
You bet I am enthusiastic! It is just nice to use a product that is so flexible. Rather than be held back by the limitations of a product, with Matrix, it seems that there are rarely limitations to what I want to do, and that is very encouraging and exciting.
Yes, maybe there are some situations where Matrix would not be the best choice, but we could say that about anything.
And, if there is some lack of functionality that someone is needing, they can always develop it, and submit it back to Squiz so that we can all benefit from it! Hooray for open source!
[quote]You bet I am enthusiastic! It is just nice to use a product that is so flexible. Rather than be held back by the limitations of a product, with Matrix, it seems that there are rarely limitations to what I want to do, and that is very encouraging and exciting.
Yes, maybe there are some situations where Matrix would not be the best choice, but we could say that about anything.
And, if there is some lack of functionality that someone is needing, they can always develop it, and submit it back to Squiz so that we can all benefit from it! Hooray for open source![/quote]
I can't wait to see the new Pacific Union College website. Any thoughts about go-live date?
We really hope to launch in the next few months. We only have a small 2 man team, but we are really excited about our progress. So, I will let everyone know here on the forums when we go live, but expect it to launch in the next few months.
Slowly, carefully and in a testing environment first, would be my advice. However, the benefits once you have finished upgrading would be fantastic. As Rafal says, all of our upgrade processes are on the website, so just follow each one. You will need to upgrade from version to version, so v3.10 -> v3.12 -> v3.14 -> v3.16.
Yes, but its unfair to us to continue to use an older version and then complain about it. We can only add fixes and features to newer versions, so you should plan upgrades as part of your support arrangements.
Having said that, it isn't that much work to upgrade v3.10 to 3.16, it's just time-consuming depending on the size of the system. I would probably plan on taking about a day to do it myself.
[quote]1. We have several very large systems that run Matrix without performance issues – you need to ensure that your resources are adequate to meet your performance requirements. You also need to ensure that you have enabled the Cache Manager for at least Public level caching and enabled the Send Cacheable Headers option in the System Configuration.
2. We have no reported bugs about purging the trash. If you are experiencing problems with this, please report your issues so that we can work to resolve them.
3. You can install individual installations of Matrix for each website on the same hardware if you want separate databases for each site.
4. Matrix does not run on Java – it is a pure PHP application. The only piece of Java is the asset map (which runs on the client, not the server)
5. We run very, very complex websites in Matrix. Matrix provides endless configuration capabilities.
6. As I said, we have several very large websites (500,000+ items) running Matrix.
7. Matrix is written in PHP, so all server-side development would be in PHP, not Java.
8. Matrix supports structured importing from several sources: XML, CSV, HTML and Word, as well as bulk binary file importing.
9. Again, we run very large sites with lots of authors (100+) without any issues.
10. Listings need to be configured appropriately with the size of the document store in mind.
11. True, but it is pretty simple to integrate the SSV version of Matrix to other applications like IP.Board and other PostgreSQL/MySQL based applications through the DB Data Source
12. I'd need more information to comment on this!
13. True, there is a process to make small changes, including locking. This is to ensure data integrity though and is usually pretty quick, especially when you use the keyboard shortcuts (Alt-A to lock, Alt-R to release, Alt-S to save in IE, Alt-Shift-A, Alt-Shift-R and Alt-Shift-S in Firefox).
Obviously this forum is provided to assist MySource Matrix users with implementation and support, but please ensure that this doesn't turn into a Matix-bashing thread. :)[/quote]
Thank you all for replies.
Honestly I love the idea of MySource Matrix and the way everything is structured, but…
Just to make everything clear: I'm running version 3.10 SSV. There was test update on it but all went completely wrong and it would take half year to fix all the issues with 50 websites we have there, so there is not much choice now, but to live with it. Also new installation 3.16 with is much better but there are still some issues.
re: 1. Our Matrix is on one of Squiz server and it's getting slower and slower with every single asset created, can't do much in configuration because have no access as a root user… Would be good if every single website had one database with access to it, that would help a lot with speed I think…
re: 2. The bug was reported few times, I know there was a script in use to purge the trash but I still can't do it myself…
re: 3. hmmm? good idea… will you give us access to databases?
re: 4: It's like saying that steering wheel and breaks are not part of the car… So I'll just say to clients with java problems or people who can't install new applications in the offices that it's php so they shouldn't have a problem.
re: 5. 6. We run many complex websites and very often I can see brick wall because something is not very possible. And if it is, takes long time creating and updating later or it have to be remote content.
Example: I have few websites and don't want to give admin rights and long, frustrating for client training. So trying to create something easy to update and create new pages or upload pdfs. Ok simple - asset builder - and then client asking me how can he delete old items. Yes I know, I can use triggers but that is not really solving the problem.
re: 7. We have no access to server and no access to source, so only java or remote content save us at the moment with more complicated stuff.
[quote]re: 3. hmmm? good idea... will you give us access to databases?[/quote]
Again, talk to Squiz UK about this.
[quote]re: 4: It's like saying that steering wheel and breaks are not part of the car... So I'll just say to clients with java problems or people who can't install new applications in the offices that it's php so they shouldn't have a problem.[/quote]
No, you need to upgrade to the latest version of MySource Matrix (v3.16) to minimise the impact on your clients.
[quote]Yes I know, I can use triggers but that is not really solving the problem.[/quote]
Actually, that's exactly solving the problem -- that's one of the key reasons triggers were designed in the first place. To allow front-end operations that we don't really want to expose via the Simple Edit interface.
[quote]re: 7. We have no access to server and no access to source, so only java or remote content save us at the moment with more complicated stuff.[/quote]
You could chose to run your own server though.
[quote]re: 8. SQL? without your help ???[/quote]
Not directly from SQL -- you would need to export at HTML, which is the easiest source to import from within the Administration Interface.
[quote]re: 11. Can we do it ourselves ???[/quote]
Yes, if you have the SSV version installed and you can make database connections from your Matrix server to the 3rd party database.
It sounds like a lot of your issues are based on your hosting environment with Squiz UK. I would speak to them to see if you can negotiate higher levels of access or assistance in upgrading your existing installations. If you can tell me how big the backup for your v3.10 system is, I can see if it is feasible for me to take a copy and do some trial upgrades on it myself.
This is a great post worth reading, but I think it’s good to bash Matrix until it becomes perfect.
So here’s my 2p on this thread:
Slawek, if you’re on 3.10 and you’re having the same issues as we had on that build (depressingly slow – angry staff smashing monitors – and so on) you are wasting your time and probably feeling pretty hostile toward the productivity of Matrix right now. I was at wits end on 3.10, until we upgraded to 3.14 and got our own dedicated server.
That upgrade process however was a nightmare. As all assets get an added ‘directory’ from 3.10 to 3.14 loads of our CSS broke. All design customisations broke – which meant I also had to redesign substantial parts of our sites.
Sounds bad? Not at all. It was totally worth the effort to upgrade.
3.14 (and up I guess) works faster which made the entire team here work sharper and better. It provided me around an entire year free of Matrix problems until recently. For the fist time ever I felt that Matrix enabled me rather than limited me.
[quote]Ha ha that's my point - too much hassle![/quote]
It's all a matter of cost / benefit / productivity analysis. I cry inside just thinking about how to get a Matrix site of 30K assets into another CMS. By the way I did a simple calculation and I estimate that it would take us 550 hours to move our system onto another enterprise system…
