someone ask me why not use other CMS like joomla…
i cant tell him much because i havent used joomla yet…
but i supposed you guys can tell something about "Mysource matrix vs joomla"…
Not really – we don't use Joomla either. 
One big, maybe the most, difference is that Joomla has an enormous community driven plugin/module archive. You can find almost any kind of plugin to the standard Joomla installation which can extend functionality.
Joomla is not (what I know) an out-of-the-box enterprise CMS, which MySource Matrix is.
MySource is owned by Squiz which can supply with services and support as well as bug fixing and development.
[quote]One big, maybe the most, difference is that Joomla has an enormous community driven plugin/module archive. You can find almost any kind of plugin to the standard Joomla installation which can extend functionality.
Joomla is not (what I know) an out-of-the-box enterprise CMS, which MySource Matrix is.
MySource is owned by Squiz which can supply with services and support as well as bug fixing and development.[/quote]
I think this is the crucial point. By relying on the community stuff you have a bigger task maintaining / upgrading all the separate bits (that may be tested to varying degrees) with no guarantee that they will continue working. I abandoned 'Mambo' when the whole fork happened to create joomla and no-one knew what was going to happen / which packages were going to maintained against which codebase etc
Also while having lots of addons is great - the Enterprise approach (as with other CMS products) is to provide a framework you can extend to your own uses - as you can see from the creativity of members of this forum (which is greatly appreciated). I do think that that a great add-on to the MSM would be a way to export an asset as a tool that can be shared / imported. I.E. If I have a really great asset builder / metadata / paint layout combo that does XYZ it would be great to be able to export that as a 'tool' that others could use also by importing it (just DB entries after all - ok may need a bit of tweaking to create consistent import locations but a top level asset called 'addons [or something] with the asset type folders to hold the add ons then you could clone them to the site areas as needed… sorry - just rambling now 
K
[quote]I do think that that a great add-on to the MSM would be a way to export an asset as a tool that can be shared / imported. I.E. If I have a really great asset builder / metadata / paint layout combo that does XYZ it would be great to be able to export that as a 'tool' that others could use also by importing it (just DB entries after all - ok may need a bit of tweaking to create consistent import locations but a top level asset called 'addons [or something] with the asset type folders to hold the add ons then you could clone them to the site areas as needed… sorry - just rambling now
K[/quote]
We did actually build that for a client. It has huge disadvantages though - there are so many external dependencies (metadata, tags, paint layouts, design customisations, permissions etc) that it is rather difficult to actually use in real situations.
There is something similar in the core anyway -- export_to_xml.php and import_from_xml.php will do something along these lines, but like Justin said it is limited..
Yeah my ramble ended as I was thinking through the complexity of it :-S Complex not the the same as impossible tho ;-) I think the addon/library top-level folder that could be the import location (desktop products like dreamweaver do this for example) and then clone from there would be workable - I have some thing like that anyway for assets I've built that can just be cloned as needed. Actually ties into the above discussion, as with the more community lead stuff anyone could go off and implement this - but to keep a consistent product the lead is best coming from the developers. idle thoughts anyway...
If it makes you feel any better, I believe the MySource 4.0 developers want to have something like this. Not sure if its in the initial development roadmap though.
I don't have that much experience with Joomla, however I spent some time playing with ezPublish.
Feel free to read my blog about MM vs ezPublish (Jan 2007)
ezPublish and MySource Matrix
wow, wow man. Where have u seen out-of-the-box here?
I can't even install the damn thing. Can't say that about Joomla! Why do Mysource Matrix programmers use feet to write code instead of hands?
Create database via phpmyadmin (or whatever u use) and run installation script via web browser - what is wrong with that, it will check all the requirements and will tell you what you require?
Why do we need to ssh to the server and install scripts via running php in console?
Installation scripts are awful - no error system. I went through step 1 and never saw any success message - damn thing just printed phpcode to my screen (but it did create files, etc. - why don't make a message "step1 has been done" or so).
But I stuck on step 2.
Here we go: http://forums.matrix.squiz.net/index.php?showtopic=4889&st=30#entry25830
Hi guys
I am not as hard core a developer as you ppl all appear to be but I do know that when I made the comment to my Uni lecturer that Joomla was not an enterprise scale CMS I was put right in my place with her list of 'enterprises' running it.
I have now got hands on experience using and designing themes for Drupal Joomla and Matrix and sadly have to report that matrix runs a sorry third in that particular area.
Some things 'out of the box' that Joomla and Drupal provide are tick box installations for Forums, Log in screens, Photo galleries and any other module you can add into the system (many available). This makes them very simple and consistent to use.
That is very true. Matrix does not provide these sort of features out of the box and I would never suggest that it does. It is much harder to implement than a CMS like Joomla, but you get increased flexibility instead. That is one of the trade-offs between different CMS products. With Matrix, you can change pretty much everything, including your editing interface, but you need to work for it.
Users of our product want this flexibility. They want to be able to not only produce sites that do not look like they came pre-loaded in their CMS, but also editing interfaces that match their internal work processes. All this needs to be done without ever writing any server-side code. This is an area in which Matrix does not run 3rd to Joomla and Drupal. It is very much a front-runner in the CMS market for this kind of work.
[quote]That is very true. Matrix does not provide these sort of features out of the box and I would never suggest that it does. It is much harder to implement than a CMS like Joomla, but you get increased flexibility instead. That is one of the trade-offs between different CMS products. With Matrix, you can change pretty much everything, including your editing interface, but you need to work for it.
Users of our product want this flexibility. They want to be able to not only produce sites that do not look like they came pre-loaded in their CMS, but also editing interfaces that match their internal work processes. All this needs to be done without ever writing any server-side code. This is an area in which Matrix does not run 3rd to Joomla and Drupal. It is very much a front-runner in the CMS market for this kind of work.[/quote]
Beautiful Greg. Said just what I was thinking! :)’ /> I most definitely agree with what you have said, flexibility is the #1 reason we use Matrix, and love it. If I would have had to do our new PUC website with Joomla, I would have quit my job a year ago! <img src=‘http://forums.matrix.squiz.net/public/style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/smile.gif’ class=‘bbc_emoticon’ alt=’
Hi Guys
Like I said I am not a developer just a bit higher level of user than most.
I agree that Joomla is inflexible and damned frustrating in the sense that every time I want to modify graphics on the theme I have to disengage the current theme and delete before uploading the new one.
Drupal on the other hand is pretty flexible. I work with a developer who's day job was Development Director for the Discovery Channel and who is now with National Geographic and he can make our Drupal installation stand on it's head. There is a lot of out of the box functionality that any site needs at the touch of a button. Menus for example adding and modifying them is a breeze as is adding feature blocks of content anywhere on the page.
Have you ever used Drupal? I am sure Matrix is wonderful IF you know how to make it do what you want it to. You all know how to do it, I on the other hand can go into Drupal and configure a Paypal Module, set up recurrent subscriptions for users and style it as I want in CSS and HTML having never set eyes on it before. In Matrix I struggle to find all the little nooks and crannies that i have to make live before getting anything going. It is powerful but very complicated. I find it hard to believe that very powerful cannot also be made user friendly in today's world.
My users (a Government enterprise) are all asking for those things that Matrix does not yet have like a Wiki…
Anyone help me with that???
Ta
Linda
Yes, I have used Drupal, but I have never deployed a site with it - I obviously tend to use Matrix 
It is a good product. It is just very different, which is why Matrix and Drupal (and Joomla) are very hard to compare.
Matrix certainly does have a steep learning curve and it is not the most user friendly CMS. However, instead of redesigning the entire interface and causing havoc for our existing clients (imagine the re-training costs) we are putting most of our efforts in the next MySource version, which is truly amazing by the way. It combines the best of both worlds; flexibility to change the pre-loaded content with an amazing user interface.
For Matrix, we make changes where we can, but a lot of out clients use our simple edit interface so their users never have to see the admin screen. Only admins play around in there. Our clients are pretty clever too, so I've seen some amazing simple edit interfaces that have been built. Nic's is truly great. Check out his blog for info.
[quote]My users (a Government enterprise) are all asking for those things that Matrix does not yet have like a Wiki…[/quote]
Matrix doesn't include a wiki and probably never will. A wiki is a specialised product and is different from a traditional CMS. My personal opinion is that there is no point in Squiz developing a wiki, forum or blog product (or even enterprise search) when there a products already out there that will always do the job better because the developers behind them are dedicated experts in that area. Our expertise is content management systems, so we tend to integrate with 3rd party applications like IP.Board.
We have, to my knowledge, not done a close integration with a wiki. But a lot of gov client use Active Directory for their user system. Matrix has great integration with AD, allowing you to not only log in with your AD account but also use AD groups for permissions and workflow. If you use a wiki that also has AD integration, you'll have two products that will feel integrated without the complexity of doing a full integration, and they will both be great at what they do best.
Hi Greg
As I am being asked for this functionality I have just put in a call to your Support team for someone to ring me re:- integrating an existing Open Source product or adding one into Matrix (I take it this is not going to be the preferred option).
I will look forward to the new Matrix - when is the rollout?
Linda
No specific release date has been set, but it will be shown at the Matrix user conference in October. It is not a replacement for Matrix yet though. Rather, an alternative for less complex sites.
Greg, will it not have the same feature set and functionality like Matrix? I was interested by your comment about it being for less complex sites. So, for our PUC site, which in my opinion, is pretty complex, would something like MySource 4 (in the far future) not be a good option for us?
Just curious...and can't wait to get my hands on the demos at MMIUC2008. :)
The product we show at the conference will not be for a site like PUC, but the full version of MySource4 will be. I can't really say more than that. You'll need to wait for an official release.
I am loving the secrecy of this! It reminds me of my other favorite company, Apple. :)